Photo: John Ondrasik shares Stephen Schwartz’s moment of glory at the Songwriters Hall of Fame, June 18, 2009, New York City. Photographer: Jessica Schwartz, Stephen’s daughter, who attended the big event.
Blog Article by Carol de Giere
June, 2009
To be “inducted” into the Songwriters Hall of Fame is an honor saved for a few famed artists each year, which makes it a rare experience on its own. For inductee Stephen Schwartz, what made the 40th Songwriters Hall of Fame evening special was not so much the plexiglass trophy he could take home to place beside his golden Oscars and Grammys, but the people being honored at the same time.
Schwartz was among seven songwriting talents inducted this year. His honor came from the status of his songs in American culture, like “Corner Of The Sky,” from Pippin “Day By Day,” from Godspell, the Oscar-winning song “Colors Of The Wind,” from Pocahontas for which he wrote lyrics, and “Defying Gravity” from Wicked.
Other inductees and their hits included:
Eddie Brigati and Felix Cavaliere from The Rascals: “Groovin’,” “How Can I Be Sure,” “A Beautiful Morning,” “Good Lovin’”),
Crosby, Stills & Nash: “Teach Your Children,” “Southern Cross,” “Wooden Ships,” “Suite Judy Blue Eyes,”
Jon Bon Jovi and Richie Sambora: “Living On A Prayer,” “Wanted Dead Or Alive,” “Blaze Of Glory,”
Roger Cook and Roger Greenaway: “Long Cool Woman In A Black Dress,” “This Golden Ring,” “Green Grass,” “Here Comes That Rainy Day Feeling Again”
Galt MacDermot, James Rado, and the late Gerome Ragni: “Aquarius/Let The Sunshine In,” “Hair,” “Good Morning Starshine,” and “Easy To Be Hard”
Sir Tom Jones would receive the Howie Richmond Hitmaker Award for his long career of pop hits such as “Delilah,” “She’s A Lady,” “It’s Not Unusual and What’s New Pussycat?”
The legendary songwriting team behind Motown hits such as “You Can’t Hurry Love” and “Stop! In The Name of Love” had previously been inducted, but at this 2009 ceremony, Holland-Dozier-Holland were to receive the Johnny Mercer Award. There were also special trophies distributed for unique achievements, such as The Towering Song Award for “Moon River,” and the Hal David Starlight Award would go to Jason Mraz as the most promising up and coming artist.
The Big Night Arrives
As this year’s sold-out event on June 18th began, about 1000 attendees flocked to the Marriott Marquee in Times Square for the $1000 a plate dinner. TV cameras and print photographers filled up the entryway where some of celebrity recipients paused to answer questions. A Rolling Stones magazine journalist captured a comment from an inductee of the evening. “On a night like this, it comes back to one thing: the power of the pen,” Jon Bon Jovi said. “If you write one song that comes across decades, you’re lucky. If you write a body of them and you’re recognized in the Songwriters Hall of Fame, it’s prestigious.”
Blogger Mike Ragogna who was on the scene reported that many of the evening’s highlights came from stories or praise the presenters gave: “…it was a hoot to watch the admiration by most hosts of their particular act, like when Five For Fighting’s John Ondrasik spoke like a fanboy about his winner, Broadway’s Stephen Schwartz, before eventually singing their co-write, ‘Slice.’”
Ragogna also wrote that “James Taylor couldn’t say enough good things about Crosby, Stills & Nash. He also performed a medley of their signature songs ‘A Long Time,’ ‘Teach Your Children,’ and ‘Love The One You’re With’ as the perfect tribute to his friends and past vocal collaborators.”
The audience was treated to performances by such talents as Crosby, Stills, and Nash offering their own “Helplessly Hoping,” BeBe Winans singing “You Can’t Hurry Love,” Clint Black playing Cook and Greenaway’s “Long Cool Woman In A Black Dress.” Henry Mancini’s daughter Monica and “Moon River’s” original crooner, Andy Williams, entertained with that classic piece.
When it was Schwartz’s turn to say a few words and perform “Defying Gravity” from Wicked, he accepted the trophy with gratitude. He talked about how thrilled he was to be inducted on the same night that Holland-Dozier-Holland were getting an award because they had changed how he listened to music. In 1964, his first year of college, he became enamored with the songs that Brian Holland, Lamont Dozier, and Eddie Holland wrote for the Supremes, The Four Tops, and others.
Schwartz also mentioned how great it was that the writers of Hair were being acknowledged, since without them and their show, Godspell would not have been possible.
The evening ended late enough that the current cast of Hair could come over and join the musical’s writers, along with former members of the Fifth Dimension, in singing rousing versions of “Aquarius” and “Let the Sun Shine In.”
Thirty-eight years passed between the time Schwartz wrote the finale of Godpsell and this night when he enjoyed being honored for the sunshine he had brought to others.
Recommended Online Resources:
Read all about Godspell, Pippin, Wicked and other Schwartz musicals at http://www.musicalschwartz.com/
This January, Stephen Schwartz and I will be reprising our presentation from October 30th in two new locations: Chicago and San Francisco. See details below.
PHOTO:
Wearing lime green on Wicked’s 5th Anniversary October 30th, 2008, Stephen Schwartz came out to Barnes and Noble in New York City near Lincoln Center to talk about his songwriting process. The gathered audience of about 220 people listened to him play “Corner of the Sky” and “For Good.”
I managed to catch a corner of Stephen’s busy schedule to fit in the two upcoming events.
I’ll put the details in here in press release form. Note that the Skokie event is early evening so you can still make it to Wicked or another show that night. Stephen himself plans to attend Wicked that evening - the last time he’ll see the Chicago production before it closes on January 25th.
Meet Wicked’s Stephen Schwartz in Skokie Illinois
Two weeks before Wicked closes after its long run in Chicago, the show’s composer/lyricist Stephen Schwartz will appear in Skokie on January 10, 2009, with host Carol de Giere, author of Defying Gravity: The Creative Career of Stephen Schwartz from Godspell to Wicked. Schwartz will discuss his work, answer questions and perform several of his songs at Barnes & Noble Booksellers, 55 Old Orchard Center in Skokie at 5:30 pm. He will join Ms. de Giere in autographing the book, and will also sign other memorabilia for those who purchase the book.
Defying Gravity takes readers behind the scenes for the making of Schwartz-related musicals from Godspell in 1971 through Wicked in 2003. The Wicked section of the book spans 150 pages and covers the story of the show’s developmental stages.
Schwartz, whose hit musicals Pippin, The Magic Show, and Wicked have each run more than 1900 performances on Broadway, also holds three Academy Awards. He recently received a Grammy Award nomination for songs for Disney’s Enchanted, which he wrote with Alan Menken.
Stephen Schwartz In Conversation and Song in San Francisco
Monday, January 26, 2009 at 7:00 pm
Stephen Schwartz, composer-lyricist of the international blockbuster musical Wicked, will appear for an evening of conversation, song, and book signing at the Museum of Performance & Design (MPD) asWicked returns home to San Francisco on January 27 for an open-ended engagement at the Orpheum Theatre.In conversation with host Carol de Giere, author of the new biography Defying Gravity: The Creative Career of Stephen Schwartz from Godspell to Wicked, Schwartz will describe some of his songwriting methods, answer questions about his work and the making of Wicked, and perform several of his popular pieces at the piano.Following the presentation, he will join Ms. de Giere in autographing the book.
The event takes place on Monday, January 26, 2009 at 7:00 pm at the Museum of Performance & Design (MPD), located on the Fourth Floor of the Veterans Building, 401 Van Ness Avenue (@ McAllister) in San Francisco. Admission is free, but space is limited and reservations are recommended — call 415-255-4800, ext. *810. For more information, visit the Museum’s website, www.mpdsf.org. Book sales for this event are courtesy of Books, Inc. in Opera Plaza (www.booksinc.net).
Defying Gravity takes readers behind the scenes for the making of Schwartz-related musicals from Godspell in 1971 through Wicked in 2003. The Wicked section of the book spans 150 pages and covers the story of the show’s developmental stages. More information is available on the book’s website at www.defyinggravitythebook.com
In 2008 at age sixty, Stephen Schwartz reached a new threshold. In July, Wicked passed Pippin and The Magic Show in number of continuous performances on Broadway. All three have run over 1900 performances, making Schwartz the only songwriter in Broadway history with three shows that have reached this milestone. He also holds three Academy Awards. He recently received a Grammy Award nomination for songs for Disney’s Enchanted, which he wrote with Alan Menken. Come meet this living legend.
Wicked, the untold story of the witches of Oz, had its world premiere at San Francisco’s Curran Theatre on May 28, 2003. This opening followed a long development process during which the entire creative team and cast immersed themselves in the brand-new material at the Curran Theatre to launch a spectacular phenomenon that has since redefined theatrical pop culture. Since having its official Broadway opening at the Gershwin Theatre on October 30, 2003, Wicked has been sold out at virtually every performance, breaking house records with box office receipts of over $1.4 million per week. It has been called “Broadway’s biggest blockbuster” by the New York Times and “a cultural phenomenon” by Variety. Wicked returns home to San Francisco on January 27 for an open-ended engagement at the Orpheum Theatre.
MORE ABOUT WICKED
Read all about Wicked on my Stephen Schwartz fan site Wicked pages!
This podcast with Stephen Schwartz is about his lyrics for the songs from Disney’s Enchanted, and is part of the 30th issue of The Schwartz Scene newsletter. It was recorded on February 15, 2008
Listen to the podcast by clicking the arrow button immediately below (Internet Explorer and Opera browser users click the button twice):
Carol de Giere: Welcome to this podcast about Disney’s Enchanted. I’m Carol de Giere and with me is songwriter Stephen Schwartz, who wrote the lyrics for the songs of this movie. We’re recording this for The Schwartz Scene from www.theschwartzscene.com.
Stephen, I’m hoping you can share a few comments for our listeners who may either be songwriters themselves or who are interested in the craft of writing songs.
First of all, let’s talk about the assignment you and Alan Menken were given and how you conceptually approach writing songs for movies. Was it up to you to discover the ways that songs might advance the story?
Stephen Schwartz: In the case of Enchanted, a screenplay existed, a screenplay that had been worked on for many, many drafts and through many, many writers until they finally came back to the original conceiver and original writer Bill Kelly. The screenplay that we received and that I read was not only terrific, but very, very close to the screenplay that was actually shot. This wasn’t one of those cases where a great deal changed during the writing and filming process, because that screenplay had been gone over and worked over by Kevin Lima, the director, with Bill, so it was more of a shooting script, in a way, than perhaps other cases might be.
And there were places for songs already built into the screenplay. They knew that they wanted to open in the whole animated world with a song [”True Love’s Kiss”]. The idea of Giselle cleaning up the apartment and having the vermin come and help her was already in the screenplay [”Happy Working Song”]. I’m not really sure whether they knew that was going to be a song or not. I don’t really remember if it said “song here” or just a scene and Alan and I decided that should be a song.
Definitely [with] “So Close,” the idea for it was not only already in the script, but the title was in the script. Kevin suggested the title, “So Close,” which I really liked.
We added “That’s How You Know.” That scene was in the script, and maybe there was an idea that it was a musical number, but we added the whole idea of her singing, and Robert being embarrassed about it and asking her not to sing, and gradually all the different people in the park joining in. We added the idea of the steel drum guy who would play along with her, etc. That was all something that Alan and I came up with. But I think that spot for a song already existed in the script.
And then the last number, “Ever Ever After,” which is the voiceover, that was something that I felt very strongly about. That was not in the script and I kept saying to the director, to Kevin, “Look, you have to close this movie musically. You cannot just close in a scene.” And ultimately, after a few false starts and cul-de-sacs, we discovered a way to do that.
Carol de Giere: I guess there’s this whole evolution that you’ve talked about before about how it begins with the old Disney.
Stephen Schwartz: Classic Disney.
Carol de Giere: Could you explain that?
Stephen Schwartz: One of the ideas which sort of emerged a little bit, it wasn’t something that was that conscious from the very beginning, but we knew that we wanted to start in really Classic Disney. This was something that I felt strongly about and sort of pushed towards, because for a while there was a discussion of, should the opening number that became “True Love’s Kiss” -Oh that was also Kevin’s title, which I liked and wanted to keep, and kept through several versions, and Alan kept saying, “Maybe we should have a different title” as we were struggling to solve the song, and I kept saying, “No, no, no, I really like the title, we just have to figure out how to do it better”-there was some talk about whether or not that should be more of an “Alan Menken style” number, like “Belle” from Beauty and the Beast.
I felt very strongly that we wanted to be in the world of Snow White, Sleeping Beauty, and Cinderella. And so Alan and I watched those movies and looked at the opening numbers, or first couple of numbers, and really tried to be in that sensibility, both musically and lyrically. I mean I made fun of it a little bit. But basically the idea was to both honor and send up the songs for Sleeping Beauty, well, not Sleeping Beauty so much as Cinderella and particularly Snow White.
Carol de Giere: And then you moved forward.
Stephen Schwartz: Then we moved forward so the second song is also [a send-up from] Snow White. “Happy Working Song” is basically the sensibility of Snow White transported to modern day New York, and that’s what’s funny about it. She’s dealing with rats and pigeons and cockroaches, but she’s still singing as if they were adorable furry bunnies and little fluffy rabbits and elves and birds, etc.
But then we started moving forward in time, in a way. As the character Giselle develops as a character and becomes more of a contemporary young woman, the score becomes increasingly contemporary. So “That’s How You Know,” which is kind of the centerpiece, that is an Alan Menken number. That’s meant to send up “Under the Sea” and “Kiss the Girl” [from The Little Mermaid] and to some extent send up “Topsy-Turvy” from The Hunchback of Notre Dame and all the sort of big Disney production numbers that came in with the new golden age of animation that Alan started with Howard Ashman. And I think the idea of the Caribbean quality, or in this case, Jamaican, that starts “That’s How You Know” was directly related to the fact that we wanted to send up “Under the Sea” a little bit.
So by that time, therefore, we’re sort of in the 90s Disney. And then “So Close” is deliberately meant to refer to the title song of Beauty and the Beast. And, in fact, Kevin Lima always planned to have the famous camera move that was built into Beauty and the Beast where they are dancing and the fake camera in animation, or the digital camera, swirls around them; he wanted to recreate that camera move live. So part of the assignment was to build in a dance section where that camera move could take place.
Finally, at the very end, the solution to “Ever Ever After” was to do it like real contemporary animation where the characters aren’t even singing on screen-it’s a voice over and the action is happening while you’re hearing the voice over, so you’ve come all the way to our contemporary sensibility.
Carol de Giere: You’ve talked before about starting with titles and you’ve mentioned that a couple were provided. So I’m curious about the advantage that it gives you to start with a title, and also, for the ones we don’t know, like “Happy Working Song,” did you start with that first before you wrote the song? And for “That’s How You Know?”
Stephen Schwartz: “That’s How You Know?”-definitely I had the title, without question. “Happy Working Song” I’m not sure whether I had the title or more the idea that it was going to be “Whistle While You Work”-that kind of song-so I knew it would have work in it, and then Alan had that tune, and it sort of suggested, “…happy little working song” was just built into the music.
For me, the advantage of starting with a title-and I want to emphasize that it’s not arbitrary, that I don’t just say, “Oh, I’m looking at a vase of flowers, so let’s call the song “A Vase of Flowers,” a lot of thought goes into what is the title- but that thought and then the ultimate decision of what the title is going to be, focuses what the song is about. It helps to define for me what the content of the song is, so the lyrics aren’t all over the map. I’ve just found over the years that as I’ve gained experience as a songwriter, knowing the title is very helpful for me in focusing the song.
Carol de Giere: I’m curious, we know that journalists are taught to look for the who, what, when, where, and why of their story. I wonder if songwriters do that. And I was thinking about like with “Happy Working Song,” okay, who: my little friends-”Come my little friends,” and the what is clean the crud up and the where is the kitchen. Do you ever consciously do that?
Stephen Schwartz: Not at all. No. Until you said it this second it never entered my mind. I see now that you point out in “Happy Working Song” that that exists. But it’s news to me. I never thought about that at all.
Carol de Giere: It just happens.
Stephen Schwartz: It just was accident.
Carol de Giere: It helps to establish a place.
Stephen Schwartz: Sometimes a song demands that. With “Happy Working Song” that sort of demands it. “That’s How You Know” doesn’t really refer to the place, it doesn’t say here I am in the park singing this song.
I think the content of the song and what it’s about will make its demands. You’re really not writing a newspaper article. Sometimes that aspect of it is important to the story. In Sweeney Todd it’s important that when Anthony and Sweeney are singing about London at the beginning that they are referring to London. I mean, that’s part of the story and it’s important for Sondheim to establish that. But then in other songs, that doesn’t necessarily occur.
Carol de Giere: But in “That’s How You Know” it’s kind of interesting because you start out with “How does she know you love her?” and then after a chorus or a bridge or something it becomes “That’s how you know.” Do you remember consciously working with this?
Stephen Schwartz: I remember worrying about it. Because I had the title “That’s How You Know” but when we started it because of the scene that it was coming out of, the first question had to be “How does she know?” And I thought about changing the title to “That’s How She Knows” but it’s just not a good title. “That’s How You Know” is just a better title. So I tried to structure the lyrics so it could go to the real title, “That’s How You Know,” without it being too big a glitch or a speed bump, and I think I was pretty successful in doing that.
Carol de Giere: It kind of becomes a song that, she is singing it to all of us.
Stephen Schwartz: Yeah. It just seemed it needed to be more of a general statement than “That’s How She Knows” so I really didn’t want to change the title.
Carol de Giere: You’ve said before that you don’t love to write love songs.
Stephen Schwartz: No I don’t.
Carol de Giere: So how did “So Close” come out for you. It’s not exactly a love song. It’s a discovery of love, isn’t it?
Stephen Schwartz: Yeah, I think it’s definitely a love song. I mean, well, I had the title, and Kevin really wanted the last line to be “So close and still so far.” Which in a way, I mean, that song, which I think works really well in the movie, I think has little bit of a problem as a stand-alone song because it shifts gears in the middle of the song. Like the whole first part of the song, which ends with “So far we are so close,” is one idea. And then at the end of the song, which accompanies a scene where she’s now leaving, the idea changes to “So close and still so far,” which works for the movie but makes the song just a little bit of a split personality.
But anyway, the title “So Close” and where we were going with it, helped to define what the words of the song would be. And then it was such a specific situation that they were going to be physically in contact for the first time. And I had the idea, which I really had to fight for at one point-not with Kevin but because Patrick Dempsey didn’t want to sing-I had the idea that it was imperative that Robert sing along at a certain point, and so part of the song was written so the words would reflect exactly what Robert was feeling at that time, the Patrick Demsey character, and would sing that into her ear.
That was a bit of a war to get Patrick to do that. And then later on, when I saw Patrick after the movie came out, he said to me, “Why didn’t I have a song,” and I said, “Patrick, it was all we could do to get you to sing those two lines!”
Carol de Giere: Interesting. I wonder if you could talk about “bridge.” I don’t remember if you’ve talked about what a bridge in a song does. So let’s look at “Happy Working Song.” I suppose we would say it’s
Oh, how strange a place to be
Till Edward comes for me
My heart is sighing
Stephen Schwartz: Definitely. That whole section.
Carol de Giere: What’s the role of that?
Stephen Schwartz: A bridge in general, just to talk in general terms, the other term for bridge is the release. And I think that’s the more accurate term. It sort of refreshes the ear. It takes you somewhere different musically and therefore slightly different lyrically usually before you return to the tune. That’s the AABA structure. The reason for the B is that AAA can be kind of dull, though if it’s “Both Sides Now” it’s not so dull. It’s different from a verse/chorus structure which is what “Both Sides Now” or “Corner of the Sky,” for instance, is, but many, many classic songs are first verse, second verse which is musically identical to the first verse, then a release that takes you somewhere else, and then a last verse that’s an A again.
So that’s the first thing about it. And then when the music changes, then you want to go someplace lyrically that supports the change of music. In the case of “Happy Working Song,” we wanted to catch up with her story. And so there’s a little storytelling element to it. And, of course, it’s also satirical of Beauty and the Beast because musically it suggests, “I want adventure in the great wide somewhere.” It has that moment that occurs in “Belle”-it’s a similar structure, so we were sort of spoofing a little bit.
And then in “So Close” that’s really a musical choice. I basically said to Alan, “We just need to go somewhere else here. And he felt it too. It wasn’t like I was there telling him something he didn’t already know. And then he wrote that really beautiful little music, and because it was more melancholy, it suggested the lyrics that ultimately wound up there:
How could I face the faceless days
If I should lose you now?
And that was just really based on my emotional response to the music Alan wrote.
Carol de Giere: Great line. It’s a great line.
Stephen Schwartz: Thank you.
Carol de Giere: Lastly, let’s talk about writing comic songs in general and specifically the “Happy Working Song.” That’s like a “wink,” I guess, so it’s a funny situation?
Stephen Schwartz: Well, it’s a really funny idea. And full marks to Kevin Lima because it was his conception. Once you have the idea that you’re going to do “Whistle While You Work” or whatever they sing in Snow White where they’re washing the dishes, once you have the idea that you’re going to do that with rats, and, pigeons, etc., then it’s just a matter of sort of thinking of that situation.
One of the things I did for that song that inspired it was, many, many years ago there was a television special with Julia Andrews and Carol Burnett, called Julie and Carol at Carnegie Hall, and one of the things they did in it was they made fun of The Sound of Music and they sang a song that satirized “My Favorite Things.” And it was called “Pigs Feet and Cheese.” And again, it was a very similar sensibility to “Happy Working Song” in that, particularly Julie Andrews just sang everything so sweetly and she would sing lines like “Knitting and tatting and cleaning the barn” and I just found that song so hilarious that I remembered it for thirty years, or however long it’s been, since that television show. And so I thought a funny thing to do would be to do exactly what they did in that-to take the Snow White super sweet sensibility and put a lot of words in there like “toilet” and “vermin” and, you know, I just tried to think of a lot of ugly words and then just put them into the song, so she could be singing about these smelly socks and things, but with her incredibly sweet attitude. That just seemed really funny to me. But it’s all contained in the conception of the song.
That really was an easy song to write because the idea is so funny and it’s much, much easier to be funny if the idea is funny to begin with.
Carol de Giere: Great. Well, thank you so much for your time.
Schwartz also mentioned how great it was that the writers of Hair were being acknowledged, since without them and their show, Godspell would not have been possible.
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